Have heard over the years about the flaws in UWP generation in some of the older versions of Traveller something about habitable planets around sun that couldn't support them, this is briefly mentioned on one of the 1248 books, just before they give alternative data, though they don't mention how they came by the data.
Does anyone have a recommendation for the best set of generation rules or a set of house rules that fixes this?
>>Have heard over the years about the flaws in UWP generation in some
of the older versions of Traveller something about habitable planets
around sun that couldn't support them, this is briefly mentioned on one
of the 1248 books, just before they give alternative data, though they
don't mention how they came by the data.
Does anyone have a recommendation for the best set of generation rules
or a set of house rules that fixes this?
Regards
Chris<<
Well, 1248 had the help of an astrophysicist, but even before then it
was pretty obvious that an M8 V wasn't going to put out enough heat to
keep an agricultural world from being an icebox.
There are several sets of gen rules out there. It all depends on what
degree of realism you want to apply to YTU. If you want as realistic as
possible, check out EDG's system:
http://evildrganymede.net/rpgs/worldbuilding/
There are some rules at the end of Mongoose's "Traveller SRD" file that
explain what you can do to fix existing UWP's.
You can:
Bump up planet sizes to retain atmospheres.
Change stars so that they provide the right amount of heat for your worlds.
Eliminate "D" stars (white dwarves) from all systems that still have
terrestrial planets with atmospheres.
Avoid putting habitable moons around gas giants--the radiation belts are
brutal.
It's late so my brain is shutting down for the night. I'm hoping someone
will type up the others that aren't springing to mind right now.
Perhaps they're growing snow peas and iceberg lettus?
Derek Stanley
Sent from my iPad
> On May 14, 2014, at 8:23 PM, "DED [Traveller_TNE]" <> wrote:
>
> >>Have heard over the years about the flaws in UWP generation in some of the older versions of Traveller something about habitable planets around sun that couldn't support them, this is briefly mentioned on one of the 1248 books, just before they give alternative data, though they don't mention how they came by the data.
>
> Does anyone have a recommendation for the best set of generation rules or a set of house rules that fixes this?
>
> Regards
>
> Chris<<
>
> Well, 1248 had the help of an astrophysicist, but even before then it was pretty obvious that an M8 V wasn't going to put out enough heat to keep an agricultural world from being an icebox.
>
> There are several sets of gen rules out there. It all depends on what degree of realism you want to apply to YTU. If you want as realistic as possible, check out EDG's system: http://evildrganymede.net/rpgs/worldbuilding/
>
> There are some rules at the end of Mongoose's "Traveller SRD" file that explain what you can do to fix existing UWP's.
>
> You can:
> Bump up planet sizes to retain atmospheres.
> Change stars so that they provide the right amount of heat for your worlds.
> Eliminate "D" stars (white dwarves) from all systems that still have terrestrial planets with atmospheres.
> Avoid putting habitable moons around gas giants--the radiation belts are brutal.
>
> It's late so my brain is shutting down for the night. I'm hoping someone will type up the others that aren't springing to mind right now.
>
> \_/
> DED
> TNE @ Yahoo ml Admin
>
Thanks will have a look a EDG's stuff but too much math does hurt my head :)
Regards
Chris
>________________________________
From: "DED [Traveller_TNE]"
Sent: Thursday, May 15, 2014 4:22 AM
Subject: [Traveller_TNE] Re: UWP generation
>
>
>
>
>>>Have heard over the years about the flaws in UWP generation in some of the older versions of Traveller something about habitable planets around sun that couldn't support them, this is briefly mentioned on one of the 1248 books, just before they give alternative data, though they don't mention how they came by the data.
>
>Does anyone have a recommendation for the best set of generation
rules or a set of house rules that fixes this?
>
>Regards
>
>Chris<<
>
>Well, 1248 had the help of an astrophysicist, but even before then
it was pretty obvious that an M8 V wasn't going to put out enough
heat to keep an agricultural world from being an icebox.
>
>There are several sets of gen rules out there. It all depends on
what degree of realism you want to apply to YTU. If you want as
realistic as possible, check out EDG's system: http://evildrganymede.net/rpgs/worldbuilding/
>
>There are some rules at the end of Mongoose's "Traveller SRD" file
that explain what you can do to fix existing UWP's.
>
>You can:
>Bump up planet sizes to retain atmospheres.
>Change stars so that they provide the right amount of heat for your
worlds.
>Eliminate "D" stars (white dwarves) from all systems that still have
terrestrial planets with atmospheres.
>Avoid putting habitable moons around gas giants--the radiation belts
are brutal.
>
>It's late so my brain is shutting down for the night. I'm hoping
someone will type up the others that aren't springing to mind right
now.
>
>\_/
>DED
>TNE @ Yahoo ml Admin
>
>
>
>
>Does anyone have a recommendation for the best set of generation rules or a set of house rules that fixes this?
Depends entirely on whether you are working with stuff that was generated with Book 6: Scouts and its variants in MT, etc. or whether you are generating new stellar data.
The simplest fix to the pre-1998 data is simply to take all 'DM' stars (e.g. M3 D) and change them to main sequence (thus M3 D becomes M3 V). Also, if you have any planets with atmosphere 4-9 orbiting a dim M main sequence star (M4 V through M9 V) cranking them up to M0 V through M3 V.
I can't comment on what MonTrav or other post-1998 Traveller systems might produce as I don't have access to that material. However, kicking the DM stars out and "adjusting the wattage" of M main sequence stars with nominally breathable atmospheres (Earth-like) is a good start to more realistic star systems without a degree in Astrophysics.
I did at one point create a somewhat more complex conversion system for stellar data (sans Greek letters and icky math), and I'll endeavor to dig it up.
Side note: Astronomy types are pretty much confirming that habitable planets could exist in close orbits around M-type main sequence stars, even if they are close enough to be tidally locked. The result would be a world some interesting weather patterns. Link: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Habitability_of_red_dwarf_systems
>
>
> There are some rules at the end of Mongoose's "Traveller SRD" file that
> explain what you can do to fix existing UWP's.
>
> You can:
> Bump up planet sizes to retain atmospheres.
> Change stars so that they provide the right amount of heat for your worlds.
> Eliminate "D" stars (white dwarves) from all systems that still have
> terrestrial planets with atmospheres.
> Avoid putting habitable moons around gas giants--the radiation belts are
> brutal.
>
>
The first three are part of the UWP and appear to be part of the ongoing
revisions visible at the Traveller Map.
The last one is against trope, and more of a Referee's call. If I really
wanted to reflect that much realism, I would be re-arranging the
Atmospheric roll:
0- Vacuum
1- Trace
2- Exotic Very Thin
3- Corrosive Very Thin
4- Thin Pressure (Roll 9+ for Breathable Gas Mix, otherwise Exotic)
5- Corrosive Thin
6- Standard Pressure (Roll 9+ for Breathable Gas Mix, otherwise Exotic)
7- Corrosive Std
8- Insidious Std
9- Dense Pressure (Roll 9+ for Breathable Gas Mix, otherwise Exotic)
A- Corrosive Dense
B- Insidious Dense
C- Bizarre (rains molten glass, magnetic field at MRI levels all the time,
etc)
D- Roll Twice, apply to different temperature or elevation zones
E- Roll Three times, apply to different temperature or elevation zones
F- Shirtsleeve Perfect, except for the gravity.
If you could it would be nice to see as I'm generating from scratch a sector for a possible new game.
Regards
Chris
>________________________________
From: "Harold Hale [Traveller_TNE]"
Sent: Thursday, May 15, 2014 4:02 PM
Subject: [Traveller_TNE] Re: UWP generation
>
>
>
>
>>Does anyone have a recommendation for the best set of generation rules or a set of house rules that fixes this?
>
>
>Depends entirely on whether you are working with stuff that was generated with Book 6: Scouts and its variants in MT, etc. or whether you are generating new stellar data.
>
>
>The simplest fix to the pre-1998 data is simply to take all 'DM' stars (e.g. M3 D) and change them to main sequence (thus M3 D becomes M3 V). Also, if you have any planets with atmosphere 4-9 orbiting a dim M main sequence star (M4 V through M9 V) cranking them up to M0 V through M3 V.
>
>
>I can't comment on what MonTrav or other post-1998 Traveller systems might produce as I don't have access to that material. However, kicking the DM stars out and "adjusting the wattage" of M main sequence stars with nominally breathable atmospheres (Earth-like) is a good start to more realistic star systems without a degree in Astrophysics.
>
>
>I did at one point create a somewhat more complex conversion system for stellar data (sans Greek letters and icky math), and I'll endeavor to dig it up.
>
>
>Side note: Astronomy types are pretty much confirming that habitable planets could exist in close orbits around M-type main sequence stars, even if they are close enough to be tidally locked. The result would be a world some interesting weather patterns. Link: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Habitability_of_red_dwarf_systems
>
>
>
>
>
Pretty much what DED said, with these elaborations:
- Breathable atmospheres will only be on planets of size 5+ in the habitable zone.
- Planets orbiting M V and late K V stars in the Habitable Zone will be tidelocked to the star.
- Replace D companions that aren't in Far orbits with Hot Jupiters (if in a Close orbit), or Brown Dwarfs (not too many though, since they don't seem that common in planetary systems), or replace them with M V stars.
You can use the GDW 2300AD system if you have that, it's not too bad but see the caveats and fixes at [2300AD] The GDW 2300AD Worldbuilding system: Part 1 - Investigation http://evildrganymede.net/2014/01/17/gdw-2300ad-worldbuilding-system-part-1/
[2300AD] The GDW 2300AD Worldbuilding system: Part 1... http://evildrganymede.net/2014/01/17/gdw-2300ad-worldbuilding-system-part-1/ In which I examine and discuss the star and world generation system from the original GDW 2300AD rules!
View on evildrganymede.net http://evildrganymede.net/2014/01/17/gdw-2300ad-worldbuilding-system-part-1/
Preview by Yahoo
and at [2300AD] The GDW 2300AD Worldbuilding system: Part 2 â Realistic Version http://evildrganymede.net/2014/02/01/gdw-2300ad-worldbuilding-system-part-2/
[2300AD] The GDW 2300AD Worldbuilding system: Part 2... http://evildrganymede.net/2014/02/01/gdw-2300ad-worldbuilding-system-part-2/ In which I present some fixes to make the GDW 2300AD star and world generation system more realistic!
View on evildrganymede.net http://evildrganymede.net/2014/02/01/gdw-2300ad-worldbuilding-system-part-2/
Preview by Yahoo
I'm curious as to how what your system is generating is lining up with what Kepler is finding? I get that Kepler is only finding planets that transit the star from our POV and because of it's resolution and duration it's really finding a lot of big things in really tight orbits.
Derek Stanley
Sent from my iPad
> On May 15, 2014, at 3:24 PM, " [Traveller_TNE]" <> wrote:
>
> Pretty much what DED said, with these elaborations:
>
> - Breathable atmospheres will only be on planets of size 5+ in the habitable zone.
> - Planets orbiting M V and late K V stars in the Habitable Zone will be tidelocked to the star.
> - Replace D companions that aren't in Far orbits with Hot Jupiters (if in a Close orbit), or Brown Dwarfs (not too many though, since they don't seem that common in planetary systems), or replace them with M V stars.
>
> You can use the GDW 2300AD system if you have that, it's not too bad but see the caveats and fixes at [2300AD] The GDW 2300AD Worldbuilding system: Part 1 - Investigation
>
> [2300AD] The GDW 2300AD Worldbuilding system: Part 1...
> In which I examine and discuss the star and world generation system from the original GDW 2300AD rules!
> View on evildrganymede.net
> Preview by Yahoo
>
>
> and at [2300AD] The GDW 2300AD Worldbuilding system: Part 2 â Realistic Version
>
> [2300AD] The GDW 2300AD Worldbuilding system: Part 2...
> In which I present some fixes to make the GDW 2300AD star and world generation system more realistic!
> View on evildrganymede.net
> Preview by Yahoo
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
I have a different (far more complex) system that can generate systems like that. Essentially it makes the gas giants beyond the Snow Line, then migrates them inwards, then makes the terrestrial worlds within the Snow Line - however, their orbits may be affected by any gas giants that are now in the inner system (worlds can be ejected due to gravitational interactions as well).
The Katringa system in Spica Publishing's System Book 1: Katringa ( System Book 1: Katringa - Spica Publishing | DriveThruRPG.com http://rpg.drivethrustuff.com/product/86279/System-Book-1-Katringa (which I wrote) was made using that system, and has two large gas giants close to the star and a small, rocky, barely habitable planet beyond that.
System Book 1: Katringa - Spica Publishing | DriveTh... http://rpg.drivethrustuff.com/product/86279/System-Book-1-Katringa System Book 1: Katringa - System Book 1: Katringa Welcome to Katringa! System Book 1: Katringa is the first in a series of books from Spica
View on rpg.drivethrustuff.com http://rpg.drivethrustuff.com/product/86279/System-Book-1-Katringa
Preview by Yahoo
Thanks, will check it out might have a copy of 2300AD kicking around will have to have a hunt for it once I get back from work next Friday though :)
>________________________________
From: " [Traveller_TNE]"
Sent: Thursday, May 15, 2014 11:24 PM
Subject: [Traveller_TNE] Re: UWP generation
>
>
>
>
>Pretty much what DED said, with these elaborations:
>
>- Breathable atmospheres will only be on planets of size 5+ in the habitable zone.
>
>- Planets orbiting M V and late K V stars in the Habitable Zone will be tidelocked to the star.
>- Replace D companions that aren't in Far orbits with Hot Jupiters (if in a Close orbit), or Brown Dwarfs (not too many though, since they don't seem that common in planetary systems), or replace them with M V stars.
>
>You can use the GDW 2300AD system if you have that, it's not too bad but see the caveats and fixes at [2300AD] The GDW 2300AD Worldbuilding system: Part 1 - Investigation
>
> [2300AD] The GDW 2300AD Worldbuilding system: Part 1...
>In which I examine and discuss the star and world generation system from the original GDW 2300AD rules!
>View on evildrganymede.net Preview by Yahoo
> and at [2300AD] The GDW 2300AD Worldbuilding system: Part 2 â Realistic Version
>
> [2300AD] The GDW 2300AD Worldbuilding system: Part 2...
>In which I present some fixes to make the GDW 2300AD star and world generation system more realistic!
>View on evildrganymede.net Preview by Yahoo
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
One problem with bumping up the sizes of planets is that they lose their tech modifier under the Second Survey system as I understand it.
Eamon
--------------------------------------------
On Thu, 15/5/14, Jim Kundert [Traveller_TNE] <> wrote:
Subject: [Traveller_TNE] Re: UWP Generation
To:
Date: Thursday, 15 May, 2014, 16:06
There are some rules at the end of Mongoose's
"Traveller SRD" file that
explain what you can do to fix existing UWP's.
You can:
Bump up planet sizes to retain atmospheres.
Change stars so that they provide the right amount of heat
for your worlds.
Eliminate "D" stars (white dwarves) from all
systems that still have
terrestrial planets with atmospheres.
Avoid putting habitable moons around gas giants--the
radiation belts are
brutal.
The first
three are part of the UWP and appear to be part of the
ongoing revisions visible at the Traveller
Map.The last one is against trope, and more of a
Referee's call. If I really wanted to reflect that much
realism, I would be re-arranging the Atmospheric roll:
0- Vacuum1-
Trace2- Exotic Very Thin3- Corrosive
Very Thin4- Thin Pressure (Roll 9+ for Breathable
Gas Mix, otherwise Exotic)5- Corrosive Thin
6- Standard Pressure (Roll 9+ for Breathable Gas Mix,
otherwise Exotic)7- Corrosive Std8-
Insidious Std9- Dense Pressure (Roll 9+ for
Breathable Gas Mix, otherwise Exotic)A- Corrosive
Dense
B- Insidious DenseC- Bizarre (rains molten
glass, magnetic field at MRI levels all the time,
etc)D- Roll Twice, apply to different temperature
or elevation zonesE- Roll Three times, apply to
different temperature or elevation zones
F- Shirtsleeve Perfect, except for the
gravity.
...Or...given that there are undoubtedly worlds that are denser than Earth, thus would pack more mass in a smaller package, a lower limit of 5 may be plausible for the Solar System, but isn't necessarily the final answer.
We're also forgetting something. The Ancients were known to "tinker" with all manner of things--including moving planets about, pinching off pieces of the Universe from rest, blowing up perfectly good planets, etc. Giving an atmosphere to a planet that may not have developed much of one? Entirely within their abilities (I also recall reading some place that Venus may have been one of their "oops", I think it was in one of the DGP products).
Naturally, the laws of physics are still the laws of physics, and over hundreds of thousands/millions of years if a planet were given an atmosphere and a molten core that perhaps didn't develop one (or had it and lost it as with Mars), there is the likelihood that it would go back to its natural state without periodic intervention. Cue the obvious sci-fi plot "PCs must find a way to re-liquify the core of the planet using an Ancients device" or "PCs help the scientist who is trying to use an Ancients device to re-liquify the planet's core with accompanying melodrama" here....
One or two oddballs maybe a dozen, but having the Ancients responsible for
hundreds or thousands strains that suspension of disbelief.
- Sent from my SM-N900T
On May 16, 2014 6:40 AM, "Harold Hale [Traveller_TNE]" <
> wrote:
>
>
> ...Or...given that there are undoubtedly worlds that are denser than
> Earth, thus would pack more mass in a smaller package, a lower limit of 5
> may be plausible for the Solar System, but isn't necessarily the final
> answer.
>
> We're also forgetting something. The Ancients were known to "tinker" with
> all manner of things--including moving planets about, pinching off pieces
> of the Universe from rest, blowing up perfectly good planets, etc. Giving
> an atmosphere to a planet that may not have developed much of one?
> Entirely within their abilities (I also recall reading some place that
> Venus may have been one of their "oops", I think it was in one of the DGP
> products).
>
> Naturally, the laws of physics are still the laws of physics, and over
> hundreds of thousands/millions of years if a planet were given an
> atmosphere and a molten core that perhaps didn't develop one (or had it and
> lost it as with Mars), there is the likelihood that it would go back to its
> natural state without periodic intervention. Cue the obvious sci-fi plot
> "PCs must find a way to re-liquify the core of the planet using an Ancients
> device" or "PCs help the scientist who is trying to use an Ancients device
> to re-liquify the planet's core with accompanying melodrama" here....
>
>
>
>
My rule of thumb was kind of 1 per sector. Unless there was something in the UWP that just screamed ancients.
Derek Stanley
Sent from my iPhone...
> On May 16, 2014, at 10:06, "Master Uxi [Traveller_TNE]" <> wrote:
>
> One or two oddballs maybe a dozen, but having the Ancients responsible for hundreds or thousands strains that suspension of disbelief.
>
> - Sent from my SM-N900T
>
>> On May 16, 2014 6:40 AM, "Harold Hale [Traveller_TNE]" <> wrote:
>>
>> ...Or...given that there are undoubtedly worlds that are denser than Earth, thus would pack more mass in a smaller package, a lower limit of 5 may be plausible for the Solar System, but isn't necessarily the final answer.
>>
>> We're also forgetting something. The Ancients were known to "tinker" with all manner of things--including moving planets about, pinching off pieces of the Universe from rest, blowing up perfectly good planets, etc. Giving an atmosphere to a planet that may not have developed much of one? Entirely within their abilities (I also recall reading some place that Venus may have been one of their "oops", I think it was in one of the DGP products).
>>
>> Naturally, the laws of physics are still the laws of physics, and over hundreds of thousands/millions of years if a planet were given an atmosphere and a molten core that perhaps didn't develop one (or had it and lost it as with Mars), there is the likelihood that it would go back to its natural state without periodic intervention. Cue the obvious sci-fi plot "PCs must find a way to re-liquify the core of the planet using an Ancients device" or "PCs help the scientist who is trying to use an Ancients device to re-liquify the planet's core with accompanying melodrama" here....
>
>
There's a limit to density though - the materials don't exist to make small worlds that dense. It's conceivable that you could get a mercury-like world that's had even more of its silicate mantle blown away and have a density of more like 7000 or 8000 kg/m3, but they'd be rare and uninhabitable.
Traveller's problem is that it creates too many planets that are just impossible. To get the 'cannonball worlds' at the frequency that the world generation implies would mean that physics basically makes no sense there whatsoever. To explain that means that you'd have to invoke a lot of "the Ancients did it" (which I hate) or say that the universe is more full of exceptions to physics than things that actually work 'by the rules' - neither of which are good options.
One idea of the 1 world per sector, would be someone looking over all the sectors, and seeing which worlds are Ancient made. Have it form a giant network, where the Ancients could pluck the strings later on and come back out. So if you mapped out the planets on the Traveller map, you'd see a network of trade routes, systems laid out in specific lines, aso, all so the Ancients could easily travel to the far corners of their empire.
(Yes, I am basing this on the Iconians from Star trek online.)
So you'd do a lot of work to settle some war between the Solomani and Vilanii, and then you'd see:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IlZzP61VDZY
(jump to 0:38 to see the critical scene)
Todd Kes
On Friday, May 16, 2014 3:18 PM, " [Traveller_TNE]" <> wrote:
There's a limit to density though - the materials don't exist to make small worlds that dense. It's conceivable that you could get a mercury-like world that's had even more of its silicate mantle blown away and have a density of more like 7000 or 8000 kg/m3, but they'd be rare and uninhabitable.
Traveller's problem is that it creates too many planets that are just impossible. To get the 'cannonball worlds' at the frequency that the world generation implies would mean that physics basically makes no sense there whatsoever. To explain that means that you'd have to invoke a lot of "the Ancients did it" (which I hate) or say that the universe is more full of exceptions to physics than things that actually work 'by the rules' - neither of which are good options.
> My rule of thumb was kind of 1 per sector. Unless there was something in the UWP that just screamed ancients.
You pretty much figure that in and the sectors that surround the Spinward Marches you'd have more examples than 1 per sector. Ditto the Solomani Rim and sectors where humans/Vargr were transplanted (Vland, Zhodane, Provence, etc.).
FYI: I'm not actually disagreeing with the idea that there is something a bit broken about the Book 6: Scouts-based systems for generating star systems. But as you might gather, my approach toward game mechanics issues with planetary data tends to be more conservative than it is for stellar data--for a reason. Regina for example is a gas giant moon. There's no changing that and if you tried there would be an outcry. I'd be willing to bet however that no one without looking it up could tell me what sort of star(s) are in the Regina system.
Without looking it up, Regina is in orbit at around 70 diameters
around Assiniboia, which is a large gas giant probably in orbit 4, so
around 225 million km from the main pair.
The Main star Lusor (from memory) is a fairly hot F class, perhaps F3
with a DM companion. Dark Darrida is an M7V brown dwarf and orbits at
around 5000 AU from Lusor.
Unfortunately, my book 6 scouts is missing in action for a few years!
So I have to go from memoryâ¦correct me if I am wrong.
Craige Cook
----- Original Message -----
From:
To:""
Cc:
Sent:Fri, 16 May 2014 13:53:26 -0700 (PDT)
Subject:Re: [Traveller_TNE] Re: UWP Generation
> My rule of thumb was kind of 1 per sector. Unless there was
something in the UWP that just screamed ancients.
You pretty much figure that in and the sectors that surround the
Spinward Marches you'd have more examples than 1 per sector. Ditto
the Solomani Rim and sectors where humans/Vargr were transplanted
(Vland, Zhodane, Provence, etc.).
FYI: I'm not actually disagreeing with the idea that there is
something a bit broken about the Book 6: Scouts-based systems for
generating star systems. But as you might gather, my approach toward
game mechanics issues with planetary data tends to be more
conservative than it is for stellar data--for a reason. Regina for
example is a gas giant moon. There's no changing that and if you
tried there would be an outcry. I'd be willing to bet however that
no one without looking it up could tell me what sort of star(s) are in
the Regina system.
There are a few things wrong with Book 6. But the systems in the Spinward Marches weren't made with book 6, and as far as I know the Solomani Rim wasn't either.
And Regina's stars are: Lusor (F7 V) orbited by Speck (white dwarf) and Darida (M dwarf) in a distant orbit. I didn't look that up, but to be honest I was actually looking at it the yesterday so that's why I remember it ;)
By the way, if you want to see what a quadrant generated with (almost) pure Book 6 rules looks like, take a look at this one I made a few years ago (originally on the Avenger boards, reposted to my SFRPG boards): http://www.sfrpg-discussion.net/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=30&t=1051&p=13200 http://www.sfrpg-discussion.net/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=30&t=1051&p=13200
Wow, one high-population world. Is that the luck of the draw or Book 6?
Eamon
Sent from my iPad
On 17 May 2014, at 16:30, " [Traveller_TNE]" <> wrote:
> By the way, if you want to see what a quadrant generated with (almost) pure Book 6 rules looks like, take a look at this one I made a few years ago (originally on the Avenger boards, reposted to my SFRPG boards): http://www.sfrpg-discussion.net/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=30&t=1051&p=13200
>
>