I've got a pondering, when you picture holographic displays in Traveller are you thinking, Star Trek - HoloDeck kind of technology, solid looking photo realistic imagery or are you thinking more Avatar / Prometheus holo tables with projected technical displays in a kind of wireframe view with occasion moments of photo realism? Fish tank screen saver would be awesome!
I picture them in between. Photorealistic, but inside a box that is set
into a wall rather a room you walk into. I see the holo tables type of
display used for controls and tactical displays where photorealism is not
important.
--
Mario
http://mario.silent-tower.org/
On Tue, Apr 14, 2015 at 11:30 PM, Derek Stanley
[Traveller_TNE] <> wrote:
>
>
> I've got a pondering, when you picture holographic displays in Traveller
> are you thinking, Star Trek - HoloDeck kind of technology, solid looking
> photo realistic imagery or are you thinking more Avatar / Prometheus holo
> tables with projected technical displays in a kind of wireframe view with
> occasion moments of photo realism? Fish tank screen saver would be awesome!
>
> Derek Stanley
> Sent from my iPad
>
>
For me I've always pictured holographic controls in two ways. First the controls like on the bridge would have a raised holo/3D area above the keyboard/controls panel. This would be much like what we use now with our keyboards/screens. Sensors operators would have a sort of shimmering black area corresponding to the area their ship's sensors cover. Known ships would be shown in general shape and locations corresponding to their correct location in space. Unknown blips would be shown as small medium or large spheres and active signatures/pings would look like waves moving across the image. This would have the effect of putting the operator right in the image by giving the image depth, which I would think would increase their speed and accuracy.
The second way would be like the sensor/briefing room onboard the Donosev survey ships. or other ships with this installed. I can't remember just where I saw the picture but I remember it showed the Donosev's sensor room as being a fairly round room with a central holo area with a number of chairs and consuls surrounding the holo area which had a blue globe representing a planet the ship was apparently orbiting. This might be the same thing as the holo controls above, just super-sized, but being larger a person could walk right into the image and possible interact with it. The sensor operator above might be able to interact with their image, say he wants to check on battle damage to an escorting SDB, they might just reach into the image and with finger and thumb pinch the SDBs image and open their fingers to expand the image. This is not as far fetched as one might think as we now have touch screens on printers and computers.
I just don't see the Star Trek holo room where you program something and have a solid object to interact with. The ancients might have the tech to do this but I see our holo tech as more of an advance on current tech. But on the bright side with the way things are going I don't think we will have to wait for TL-13 to have holo-tech. After all it only took what, two or three years for some inventor to come up with the cell phone after Kirk's first "Beam me up Scotty". and Hollywood has been showing us holo images for a while now.
Roger
Cell phones were proposed as early as 1948. There is a synergy between TV /
Movies and real life - TV / Movie writers take information from ongoing
research and extrapolate logical conclusions from that - since they were
logical conclusions, someone does that actual work to make it happen. Cell
phones would have happened without Star Trek, since people were already
working on the precursors. Ditto for 3D displays - the proposals have been
around for much longer than they've been shown.
--
Mario
http://mario.silent-tower.org/
On Wed, Apr 15, 2015 at 6:41 AM, [Traveller_TNE] <
> wrote:
>
>
> For me I've always pictured holographic controls in two ways. First the
> controls like on the bridge would have a raised holo/3D area above the
> keyboard/controls panel. This would be much like what we use now with our
> keyboards/screens. Sensors operators would have a sort of shimmering black
> area corresponding to the area their ship's sensors cover. Known ships
> would be shown in general shape and locations corresponding to their
> correct location in space. Unknown blips would be shown as small medium or
> large spheres and active signatures/pings would look like waves moving
> across the image. This would have the effect of putting the operator right
> in the image by giving the image depth, which I would think would increase
> their speed and accuracy.
>
> The second way would be like the sensor/briefing room onboard the Donosev
> survey ships. or other ships with this installed. I can't remember just
> where I saw the picture but I remember it showed the Donosev's sensor room
> as being a fairly round room with a central holo area with a number of
> chairs and consuls surrounding the holo area which had a blue globe
> representing a planet the ship was apparently orbiting. This might be the
> same thing as the holo controls above, just super-sized, but being larger a
> person could walk right into the image and possible interact with it. The
> sensor operator above might be able to interact with their image, say he
> wants to check on battle damage to an escorting SDB, they might just reach
> into the image and with finger and thumb pinch the SDBs image and open
> their fingers to expand the image. This is not as far fetched as one might
> think as we now have touch screens on printers and computers.
>
> I just don't see the Star Trek holo room where you program something and
> have a solid object to interact with. The ancients might have the tech to
> do this but I see our holo tech as more of an advance on current tech. But
> on the bright side with the way things are going I don't think we will have
> to wait for TL-13 to have holo-tech. After all it only took what, two or
> three years for some inventor to come up with the cell phone after Kirk's
> first "Beam me up Scotty". and Hollywood has been showing us holo images
> for a while now.
>
> Roger
>
>
>
>
I wasn't really suggesting an interactive holo deck but rather images with that kind of graphical fidelity. Your first suggestion is a kind of glasses less 4k 3D TV system.
I'm going to admit to having huge issues with the current 3D system, I have scar tissue over my right cornea from an accident 20 years back so my brain doesn't really process the info coming from that eye anymore. This means the whole 3D system is utterly useless to me, no depth perception also means don't toss your 1000$ cell phone at me unless your prepared to replace it because I can't judge distance very well
There's been a number of pushes over the years to mainstream 3D and really they've mostly fizzled from what I've seen, I don't know if this a result of price point sticker shock, lack of sufficient 3D content or a general malaise over the quality / fidelity of the system.
I'm a huge fan of the practical implications of the 3D holo table / tank system, lets face it we all want the JARVIS system Tony Stark has but I imagine the holo table idea would work on a similar lines. Reach into the tank, expand, contract, rotate, roll.
I guess my own personal inability to perceive 3D on a flat screen has blinded (see what I did there?) me to it's potentials.
Derek Stanley
Sent from my iPhone...
> On Apr 15, 2015, at 03:51, Mario Butter [Traveller_TNE] <> wrote:
>
> I picture them in between. Photorealistic, but inside a box that is set into a wall rather a room you walk into. I see the holo tables type of display used for controls and tactical displays where photorealism is not important.
>
> --
> Mario
>
> http://mario.silent-tower.org/
>
>> On Tue, Apr 14, 2015 at 11:30 PM, Derek Stanley [Traveller_TNE] <> wrote:
>>
>> I've got a pondering, when you picture holographic displays in Traveller are you thinking, Star Trek - HoloDeck kind of technology, solid looking photo realistic imagery or are you thinking more Avatar / Prometheus holo tables with projected technical displays in a kind of wireframe view with occasion moments of photo realism? Fish tank screen saver would be awesome!
>>
>> Derek Stanley
>> Sent from my iPad
>>
>
>
I think since the advent of the WW2 motorola hand held radio the advent of a cell phone was inevitable. T V shows like Trek tend to push these devices into the public's field of view giving them a wider audience than just the lab / military audience they had to begin with.
When we see Kirk pull out his communicator or Bones with his tricoder we think, why can't I have one of those? The show helps fuel the demand which in turn pushes development forward.
Derek Stanley
Sent from my iPhone...
> On Apr 15, 2015, at 06:02, Mario Butter [Traveller_TNE] <> wrote:
>
> Cell phones were proposed as early as 1948. There is a synergy between TV / Movies and real life - TV / Movie writers take information from ongoing research and extrapolate logical conclusions from that - since they were logical conclusions, someone does that actual work to make it happen. Cell phones would have happened without Star Trek, since people were already working on the precursors. Ditto for 3D displays - the proposals have been around for much longer than they've been shown.
>
> --
> Mario
>
> http://mario.silent-tower.org/
>
>> On Wed, Apr 15, 2015 at 6:41 AM, [Traveller_TNE] <> wrote:
>>
>> For me I've always pictured holographic controls in two ways. First the controls like on the bridge would have a raised holo/3D area above the keyboard/controls panel. This would be much like what we use now with our keyboards/screens. Sensors operators would have a sort of shimmering black area corresponding to the area their ship's sensors cover. Known ships would be shown in general shape and locations corresponding to their correct location in space. Unknown blips would be shown as small medium or large spheres and active signatures/pings would look like waves moving across the image. This would have the effect of putting the operator right in the image by giving the image depth, which I would think would increase their speed and accuracy.
>>
>> The second way would be like the sensor/briefing room onboard the Donosev survey ships. or other ships with this installed. I can't remember just where I saw the picture but I remember it showed the Donosev's sensor room as being a fairly round room with a central holo area with a number of chairs and consuls surrounding the holo area which had a blue globe representing a planet the ship was apparently orbiting. This might be the same thing as the holo controls above, just super-sized, but being larger a person could walk right into the image and possible interact with it. The sensor operator above might be able to interact with their image, say he wants to check on battle damage to an escorting SDB, they might just reach into the image and with finger and thumb pinch the SDBs image and open their fingers to expand the image. This is not as far fetched as one might think as we now have touch screens on printers and computers.
>>
>> I just don't see the Star Trek holo room where you program something and have a solid object to interact with. The ancients might have the tech to do this but I see our holo tech as more of an advance on current tech. But on the bright side with the way things are going I don't think we will have to wait for TL-13 to have holo-tech. After all it only took what, two or three years for some inventor to come up with the cell phone after Kirk's first "Beam me up Scotty". and Hollywood has been showing us holo images for a while now.
>>
>> Roger
>>
>
>
"I've got a pondering, when you picture holographic displays in Traveller are you thinking, Star Trek - HoloDeck kind of technology, solid looking photo realistic imagery or are you thinking more Avatar / Prometheus holo tables with projected technical displays in a kind of wireframe view with occasion moments of photo realism?"
Both types actually, since the type you would use depends upon your needs. Star Trek not only had Holodecks, they also had small devices about the size of a coaster that you could sit on a table that would display a 3D image of a person or an object (e.g. the "picture" Data had of Tasha Yar). Keep in mind that while imagery is important, there are other types of immersion technologies (the first being audio immersion, with primitive stereo sound recordings first appearing in the 1880s, and modern stereophonic technology ("basic" stereo) appearing in the 1930s).
Sounds like an excuse to create an immersion technologies develop tree to me....
I think it is going to be different at different tech levels, and also different for different cultures:
Vilani: Have the tech, but cultural contraints keep them restrained to a simple green-dot CRT display with "Spock" type eyeshields.
Imperial: Different at each tech level, Each previously described system appears when technologically appropriate. I can see the solid holograms at TL 15 or so?
Solomani: Typical "movie villain" or "audience friendly" computer user interface. (I swore never to link to the TV Tropes website again. You have been warned-- turn back! It sucks your life away) Lots of big icons with completely useless floating text bars, and of course a huge honking countdown display in red, even if no countdown is needed for this operation.
Zhodani: Something exotic, probably without visible external controls, and operated by a psionic with cyber-affinity powers.
Sword Worlds: Costumed dwarfs come in and act out the information in the form of a comedy slap-fight/interpretive dance.
Vargr: Ship icons tracked with additonal scent-dispensing olfactory markers, linked to a tribal/pack relational database through a cascading -- LOOK A SQUIRREL!!!
Add your own ideas here: How do the Hivers do it? Aslan? Schialli? Go crazy. Add your own voice here.