Richard (Tim, and Uxi)--
Bear in mind that I am saying this without PoT in front of me, which is
actually just as well, as you probably have it and don't need me to tell
you what you've already read.
It's all going to be based on rapid return on investment. Remember that
the RC is a shoestring operation; they are still relying on stuff they can
pull in from beyond their frontier to keep themselves going. While they
are getting Hiver assistance it is primarily technical assistance in
repairing things they can find and advancing their own industries and
technology. They don't have enough ships or personnel to do the expansion
they seek to do, their starports can't produce ships fast enough, and they
rely to a large extent on relic starships and parts to keep their own
fleet running.
So they don't have a lot of excess materials, supplies, technology, and
personnel to raise lots of planets up. Raising the planets up is the
long-term goal, but the immediate goal is to maximize return from uniquely
valuable technology, and this is going to be in the context of a web of
cross-cutting needs to raise as much capability as cost-effectively as
possible.
This sort of thing would be very referee driven, by seeing the possibility
for high/rapid return on investment on various worlds. This would be based
on several things: 1) What are the highest value capabilities that might
be restored, with 2) the lowest possible effort, with 3) resources that
are available (parts, expertise, personnel), and 4) which would be of the
highest possible value to other ongoing restoration efforts.
Such high value capabilities would be, in approximate order:
starports/shipyards, factories that manufacture important parts for fusion
plants, jump drives, electronics, industrial tooling for factories, heavy
machinery to support agriculture, valuable key minerals such as lanthanum
and other rare earths, platinum, tungsten, rhenium, iridium, silver,
palladium, iridium, diamonds, etc., particularly things that are readily
transportable.
For example, let's say a world has rich deposits of lanthanum (the key
element in jump drives), or some other rare earths (lasers, magnets,
batteries, electronics, etc.) or other valuable industrial minerals. It
also has a damaged power production capability that could be repaired
using parts used by the RC for its own systems, so they are readily
available, though not in large numbers. The power plant could provide
power to rebuild a city and nearby agriculture in about 10 years, or power
to an extensive lanthanum/rare earth mine which could be producing in 6-12
months. This mine would provide these mineral to RC industries, provide
income to the world, and provide a reason for traders (free traders and
the RC's own growing trade fleet) to call on the world. Getting the mine
running would require moving a significant number of people to the area
who would require food. The RC would go the mine route. The mission would
be 1) to get the power plant running with RC parts and training to locals
on how to run the plant, and running the power out to the mine site, 2)
setting up a low-tech ability to manufacture basic housing (cinder blocks,
bricks) to build the mining town--which will include an RC technical
school to train the locals, 3) moving people to become mine workers, 4)
identifying suitable land for a Type E or D starport, 5) set up a
planetary government/structure to see that profits from the rare earth
trade is invested in rebuilding the remainder of the planet by
rehabilitating key industries, identified and prioritized by the bootstrap
team. However, by spending the restorable power on the mine and moving a
large chunk of population out to the mine creates the need for food.
There is another nearby waterworld (Hydro 9) whose dirtside starport and
most of the surrounding industry on the small main island had been nuked,
nothing recoverable. What does remain is a shipyard (wet navy) on an
outlying island. Survey parties report that there are huge quantities of
edible food in the seas, in the form of fish, kelp, etc. The island with
the shipyard contains a lagoon that could be used as a water landing
starport and refueling basin with piers and warehouses added around it.
The shipyard is reduced to repairing existing ships, now powered mostly by
sails, but the world supports a large community of sailors with knowledge
of how to catch fish with their degraded tools. The RC decides to 1)
provide local power by emplacing a surplus fusion power plant 2) build a
small plant with contiguous RC technical school to build diesel engines to
upgrade the shipping fleet, 3) start upgrading the shipyard to produce
new, larger ships, 4) organize larger scale fisheries and aquaculture, 5)
negotiate an arrangement where the water world ships food to the lanthanum
mine world for a share of mining profits which are re-invested on the
water world to replace its steel refineries and resurrect other local
industries.
There is third nearby world with a lot of relic unused hi-tech (TL 13-15)
facilities no longer usable due to the collapse of the power grid, loss of
trade, etc. While there are a lot of choice hi-tech goodies there, it is
beyond the RC's abilities to restore this technology. The machinery
required would have to be built to tolerances too high for the RC. But by
repurposing some of the equipment and providing some RC parts, technical
assistance, and training (and building the obligatory RC technical school)
they can build the core of a TL 12 manufacturing facility. By use of the
TL 12 3D printing technology (here's where this comes in, Traveller ought
to have 3D printing by TL 12, right) the plant first starts building parts
to expand its own production capabilities, then moves into parts for TL 12
fusion plants, jump drives, mining equipment for the lanthanum mine world,
undersea manganese nodule harvesters for the water world, and so on.
There are holes in the ideas above (not least of which is getting three
such worlds "nearby" each other) that need to be addressed by the referee
and/or inventive players, but I think you see the point. RC-style
bootstraps are not to restore a world's entire broad-spectrum economy and
technology, but to identify high-impact, rapidly developable capabilities
on different worlds that will complement and fuel each other's needs, and
most of all, encourage the interstellar trade to move those things around.
This will require more ships to be acquired, built, restored from relics,
etc., and will require security provide by RCN forces and procedures as
they knit together this interdependent economy, which goes back to why I
say that the RC is a shoestring economy which needs to keep growing and
expanding and finding new stuff so that it can keep up with the expansion
it is always trying to do.
The rules presented in WTH are, IIRC, more about building a planetary
economy from the ground up, and that is not the model I suggest here. For
the RC, The Future Is Now, and all bootstraps are conducted from that
point of view. This will require a lot of referee judgement and ruling on
what things are left to build on, what it takes in terms of time and
equipment to do so, etc. One thing it will also require, which I don't
think we addressed, is a system of money. For the near term and for a
while, it will have to be semi-barter, with these barters arranged and
guaranteed in some form by the RC, and that RC guarantee is the basis of
money eventually. If you hold that money you'll probably have a hard time
cashing it in, because it is guaranteed by the good faith and credit of
the next shoestring operation they can pull off, but the RC is not about
natural, organic growth, it is about figuring out ways to kick-start
interstellar civilization before it gets any worse, before the Vampires
come back, before the Guild gets its way, before the TEDs out there get
further entrenched, before some idiot Imperial-style government starts
back up and starts the whole mess all over again.
And those RC technical schools are intended not only to train the
technical cadre to run, rebuild, and grow those worlds, but it is also
expected that many of the students will become RC technical advisors who
will go on to serve in bootstraps on later worlds, part of the Star Viking
Peace Corps. Ask not what interstellar civilization can do for you, ask
what you can do for interstellar civilization.
That's what I think about this.
> Partially depends on know how and economic activity. I could see a
stable
> government with prosperous industrial base say TL4-5 rising more rapidly
for the government/military/corporations... fastest in an F-tech. Once
people know something is possible, it should be faster to recreate than
it
> took to develop the first time, though lack of documentation will make
some repeating if dead ends inevitable.
>
> Need to go to the assumption on what TL is, though... is it the
planetary
> average, that of the starport, or the max possible for the elites?
>
> I'd love to see some rules for that sort of thing, though.
>
> - Sent from my SM-N900T
>
>
> Does anyone have any thoughts about those RCES bootstrap missions. If
> they
> are trying to restablish a world's pre-coolapse industrial base, how
much
> of the old industrial stuff still remains, and how much effort does the
RCES have to make to get factories etc. back up and running.
>
> A large supply of power is obvious as is the tech knowledge to run it.
They
> will obviously have to replace certain components - ones with limited
life
> such as seals, but is that it. Is it just spending a few £ to get the
plant
> back up and running or is it a major rebuild job.
>
> If they are goimg to have to spend in the orer of 50% of the buiuld cost
to
> get pre-collapse plant up and running, then the RCES plans to expand
over
> diaspora and build sufficient infrastructure are not going to happen in
a
> few years but will take a decade at least - even if they only fully
uplift
> a few choice worlds.
>
> Cheers
> Richard
>
>
Bear in mind that I am saying this without PoT in front of me, which is
actually just as well, as you probably have it and don't need me to tell
you what you've already read.
It's all going to be based on rapid return on investment. Remember that
the RC is a shoestring operation; they are still relying on stuff they can
pull in from beyond their frontier to keep themselves going. While they
are getting Hiver assistance it is primarily technical assistance in
repairing things they can find and advancing their own industries and
technology. They don't have enough ships or personnel to do the expansion
they seek to do, their starports can't produce ships fast enough, and they
rely to a large extent on relic starships and parts to keep their own
fleet running.
So they don't have a lot of excess materials, supplies, technology, and
personnel to raise lots of planets up. Raising the planets up is the
long-term goal, but the immediate goal is to maximize return from uniquely
valuable technology, and this is going to be in the context of a web of
cross-cutting needs to raise as much capability as cost-effectively as
possible.
This sort of thing would be very referee driven, by seeing the possibility
for high/rapid return on investment on various worlds. This would be based
on several things: 1) What are the highest value capabilities that might
be restored, with 2) the lowest possible effort, with 3) resources that
are available (parts, expertise, personnel), and 4) which would be of the
highest possible value to other ongoing restoration efforts.
Such high value capabilities would be, in approximate order:
starports/shipyards, factories that manufacture important parts for fusion
plants, jump drives, electronics, industrial tooling for factories, heavy
machinery to support agriculture, valuable key minerals such as lanthanum
and other rare earths, platinum, tungsten, rhenium, iridium, silver,
palladium, iridium, diamonds, etc., particularly things that are readily
transportable.
For example, let's say a world has rich deposits of lanthanum (the key
element in jump drives), or some other rare earths (lasers, magnets,
batteries, electronics, etc.) or other valuable industrial minerals. It
also has a damaged power production capability that could be repaired
using parts used by the RC for its own systems, so they are readily
available, though not in large numbers. The power plant could provide
power to rebuild a city and nearby agriculture in about 10 years, or power
to an extensive lanthanum/rare earth mine which could be producing in 6-12
months. This mine would provide these mineral to RC industries, provide
income to the world, and provide a reason for traders (free traders and
the RC's own growing trade fleet) to call on the world. Getting the mine
running would require moving a significant number of people to the area
who would require food. The RC would go the mine route. The mission would
be 1) to get the power plant running with RC parts and training to locals
on how to run the plant, and running the power out to the mine site, 2)
setting up a low-tech ability to manufacture basic housing (cinder blocks,
bricks) to build the mining town--which will include an RC technical
school to train the locals, 3) moving people to become mine workers, 4)
identifying suitable land for a Type E or D starport, 5) set up a
planetary government/structure to see that profits from the rare earth
trade is invested in rebuilding the remainder of the planet by
rehabilitating key industries, identified and prioritized by the bootstrap
team. However, by spending the restorable power on the mine and moving a
large chunk of population out to the mine creates the need for food.
There is another nearby waterworld (Hydro 9) whose dirtside starport and
most of the surrounding industry on the small main island had been nuked,
nothing recoverable. What does remain is a shipyard (wet navy) on an
outlying island. Survey parties report that there are huge quantities of
edible food in the seas, in the form of fish, kelp, etc. The island with
the shipyard contains a lagoon that could be used as a water landing
starport and refueling basin with piers and warehouses added around it.
The shipyard is reduced to repairing existing ships, now powered mostly by
sails, but the world supports a large community of sailors with knowledge
of how to catch fish with their degraded tools. The RC decides to 1)
provide local power by emplacing a surplus fusion power plant 2) build a
small plant with contiguous RC technical school to build diesel engines to
upgrade the shipping fleet, 3) start upgrading the shipyard to produce
new, larger ships, 4) organize larger scale fisheries and aquaculture, 5)
negotiate an arrangement where the water world ships food to the lanthanum
mine world for a share of mining profits which are re-invested on the
water world to replace its steel refineries and resurrect other local
industries.
There is third nearby world with a lot of relic unused hi-tech (TL 13-15)
facilities no longer usable due to the collapse of the power grid, loss of
trade, etc. While there are a lot of choice hi-tech goodies there, it is
beyond the RC's abilities to restore this technology. The machinery
required would have to be built to tolerances too high for the RC. But by
repurposing some of the equipment and providing some RC parts, technical
assistance, and training (and building the obligatory RC technical school)
they can build the core of a TL 12 manufacturing facility. By use of the
TL 12 3D printing technology (here's where this comes in, Traveller ought
to have 3D printing by TL 12, right) the plant first starts building parts
to expand its own production capabilities, then moves into parts for TL 12
fusion plants, jump drives, mining equipment for the lanthanum mine world,
undersea manganese nodule harvesters for the water world, and so on.
There are holes in the ideas above (not least of which is getting three
such worlds "nearby" each other) that need to be addressed by the referee
and/or inventive players, but I think you see the point. RC-style
bootstraps are not to restore a world's entire broad-spectrum economy and
technology, but to identify high-impact, rapidly developable capabilities
on different worlds that will complement and fuel each other's needs, and
most of all, encourage the interstellar trade to move those things around.
This will require more ships to be acquired, built, restored from relics,
etc., and will require security provide by RCN forces and procedures as
they knit together this interdependent economy, which goes back to why I
say that the RC is a shoestring economy which needs to keep growing and
expanding and finding new stuff so that it can keep up with the expansion
it is always trying to do.
The rules presented in WTH are, IIRC, more about building a planetary
economy from the ground up, and that is not the model I suggest here. For
the RC, The Future Is Now, and all bootstraps are conducted from that
point of view. This will require a lot of referee judgement and ruling on
what things are left to build on, what it takes in terms of time and
equipment to do so, etc. One thing it will also require, which I don't
think we addressed, is a system of money. For the near term and for a
while, it will have to be semi-barter, with these barters arranged and
guaranteed in some form by the RC, and that RC guarantee is the basis of
money eventually. If you hold that money you'll probably have a hard time
cashing it in, because it is guaranteed by the good faith and credit of
the next shoestring operation they can pull off, but the RC is not about
natural, organic growth, it is about figuring out ways to kick-start
interstellar civilization before it gets any worse, before the Vampires
come back, before the Guild gets its way, before the TEDs out there get
further entrenched, before some idiot Imperial-style government starts
back up and starts the whole mess all over again.
And those RC technical schools are intended not only to train the
technical cadre to run, rebuild, and grow those worlds, but it is also
expected that many of the students will become RC technical advisors who
will go on to serve in bootstraps on later worlds, part of the Star Viking
Peace Corps. Ask not what interstellar civilization can do for you, ask
what you can do for interstellar civilization.
That's what I think about this.
> Partially depends on know how and economic activity. I could see a
stable
> government with prosperous industrial base say TL4-5 rising more rapidly
for the government/military/corporations... fastest in an F-tech. Once
people know something is possible, it should be faster to recreate than
it
> took to develop the first time, though lack of documentation will make
some repeating if dead ends inevitable.
>
> Need to go to the assumption on what TL is, though... is it the
planetary
> average, that of the starport, or the max possible for the elites?
>
> I'd love to see some rules for that sort of thing, though.
>
> - Sent from my SM-N900T
>
>
> Does anyone have any thoughts about those RCES bootstrap missions. If
> they
> are trying to restablish a world's pre-coolapse industrial base, how
much
> of the old industrial stuff still remains, and how much effort does the
RCES have to make to get factories etc. back up and running.
>
> A large supply of power is obvious as is the tech knowledge to run it.
They
> will obviously have to replace certain components - ones with limited
life
> such as seals, but is that it. Is it just spending a few £ to get the
plant
> back up and running or is it a major rebuild job.
>
> If they are goimg to have to spend in the orer of 50% of the buiuld cost
to
> get pre-collapse plant up and running, then the RCES plans to expand
over
> diaspora and build sufficient infrastructure are not going to happen in
a
> few years but will take a decade at least - even if they only fully
uplift
> a few choice worlds.
>
> Cheers
> Richard
>
>